tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2627032459273165000.post2769840384289335351..comments2024-03-26T05:01:57.793-07:00Comments on DREAMS ARE WHAT LE CINEMA IS FOR...: COME BACK TO THE 5 & DIME JIMMY DEAN, JIMMY DEAN 1982Ken Andersonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/04940648971296673233noreply@blogger.comBlogger25125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2627032459273165000.post-47116313850574509362020-03-08T20:00:20.515-07:002020-03-08T20:00:20.515-07:00The only "yes" I have for your interesti...The only "yes" I have for your interesting questions is that I have seen "The Cobweb." Dean is the perfect symbol of the projection quality of fame. When you die too soon for reality to intrude upon the image, fans are free to project all they need onto the fantasy that is left behind.<br />Thanks for contributing more food for thought to this post!Ken Andersonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04940648971296673233noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2627032459273165000.post-72892706716129120962020-03-07T13:51:23.047-08:002020-03-07T13:51:23.047-08:00Two questions for Ken:
Are you familiar with a bo...Two questions for Ken:<br /><br />Are you familiar with a book written by Guy Debord in 1967 called "The Society Of The Spectacle"? The passages about the relationship between celebrity and social control through mediated fantasy and insuring that economies function through displacing human misery through illusory glamour? His most distilled quote in that book being "all that is false is true; all that is true is false"? (in relation to people not living their lives for themselves instead for the "spectacle" of a false mediated consensus "reality")<br /><br />Have you ever heard of a Williams S. Burrough's book (author of Naked Lunch) called BOY?<br /><br />"and they all loved THE BOY and THE BOY was a movie star and THE BOY died violently and so they all went out and bought BOY jackets and BOY knives and BOY key chains and BOY masks and they all began to think they were THE BOY..." <br /><br />Ok. Two more questions: 1) Have you ever seen Vincente Minnelli's "The Cobweb" from 1955? Dean was asked to play the John Kerr role of a suicidal painter. One unknown and spooky piece of ephemera: That character's opening line of dialogue is "All the greatest artists are dead."<br /><br />2)Did you know that a man in the Midwest re-created Dean's actual bookshelf from his NYC apartment down to the last and most infinitesimal and period-correct 1950's detail? On that shelf was a copy of Orwell's "1984" (!) and Budd Schulberg's "A Face In The Crowd", which is utterly compelling.....Was Dean thinking of the Andy Griffith role of the country boy turned Elvis-like music star turned corrupt political media puppet-tyrant for himself? Was he already contemplating making a dark cinematic statement about the machinations of his own overnight fame? (And to think that Kazan directed it only a year after his death!)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2627032459273165000.post-69239443901030877442018-05-01T19:05:30.164-07:002018-05-01T19:05:30.164-07:00Hi Cinemarocks
Ha! I love that you found this movi...Hi Cinemarocks<br />Ha! I love that you found this movie to be so powerful! I love action movies, but CGI and sci-fi could never come up with the basic gut-level devastating power of the human drama. Altman knew this.Ken Andersonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04940648971296673233noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2627032459273165000.post-76089305749383906312018-05-01T18:42:33.044-07:002018-05-01T18:42:33.044-07:00....this movie is more powerful and devastating th.......this movie is more powerful and devastating than the first Alien or any of the Terminator films....great art and great power....just sayingcinemarocks.comhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08068980827220674196noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2627032459273165000.post-13612376643070515602016-01-05T21:17:17.978-08:002016-01-05T21:17:17.978-08:00I still use that cliche! And when in the service o...I still use that cliche! And when in the service of such a lovely compliment, there's nothing cliche about it, in my book. Thank you very much, Thom. Really.Ken Andersonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04940648971296673233noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2627032459273165000.post-83273771635094636692016-01-05T16:09:43.196-08:002016-01-05T16:09:43.196-08:00Forgive me for sounding like a broken record (Do p...Forgive me for sounding like a broken record (Do people still use that cliche?), but this is yet another excellent and thoughtful post. You never disappoint, Ken!Thombeauhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14610129742797260253noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2627032459273165000.post-65837566252758967222015-10-20T17:30:54.015-07:002015-10-20T17:30:54.015-07:00Great observations, Gregory.
I'm reading a boo...Great observations, Gregory.<br />I'm reading a book about Altman now, and I like your impression of how his films all seem to exist simultaneously in one creative universe.<br />Like you, I tend to find there to be something valuable in all Altman's films (alas, MASH is lost to me, it's his one movie I cant abide), and I think I need to revisit some of the ones I saw so long ago and had mixed feelings about (Cookie's Fortune).<br /><br />The comparison of Altman's work to Noh theater is very thoughtful and well-considered. It seems with each successive film you "revisit" by way of this blog, you grant yourself the opportunity to explore your experience of a film through a past/present prism. <br />Your deep response to movies is a perfect fit for this blog and is right in step with so many of the readers who so graciously share their comments here. Thanks, Gregory. Always a pleasure!<br />Ken Andersonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04940648971296673233noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2627032459273165000.post-28885463027814988792015-10-20T17:22:04.627-07:002015-10-20T17:22:04.627-07:00Not sure how I missed this post, but better late t...Not sure how I missed this post, but better late than never:<br />Thanks for commenting and I hope by now you have seen the film again. Sort of amazing how it holds up.<br /><br />By the way, that's the most perfect description of Sandy Dennis' conflicting appeal I've ever read!Ken Andersonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04940648971296673233noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2627032459273165000.post-10352404276184203912015-10-20T08:55:16.685-07:002015-10-20T08:55:16.685-07:00This comment has been removed by the author.Gregoryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04072841840657518591noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2627032459273165000.post-29937445279561628502015-10-19T07:50:09.586-07:002015-10-19T07:50:09.586-07:00This comment has been removed by the author.Gregoryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04072841840657518591noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2627032459273165000.post-42501843707490833272015-09-15T04:28:21.083-07:002015-09-15T04:28:21.083-07:00Another great analysis. I'm impressed with bot...Another great analysis. I'm impressed with both your thoughtfulness and research. This is another film I haven't seen in ages but you've perky my interest to see again. <br /><br />Cher was terrific in the film. Sandy Dennis's character were like over wound coils. You could feel the tension beneath the surface. When seeing her in films, I always had the conflicting emotions wanting to hug her and tell her everything is going to babe all right and wanting to run away as far as I could go. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2627032459273165000.post-14996605546132501532015-03-08T15:56:40.547-07:002015-03-08T15:56:40.547-07:00Thanks, Ken. I hadn't seen it in the archives ...Thanks, Ken. I hadn't seen it in the archives (I have read your site pretty extensively, as you know!) but I will recheck with the link.<br /><br />Last night, an angel did indeed get their leg warmers...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2627032459273165000.post-71493263567612639162015-03-08T06:15:22.881-07:002015-03-08T06:15:22.881-07:00Hi Tanyadiva!
Thank you very much for the complime...Hi Tanyadiva!<br />Thank you very much for the compliment! I absolutely adore that you're watching "Xanadu" (of all things!) Every time someone watches "Xanadu" an angel gets its leg-warmers.<br /><br />As much as I love "Jimmy Dean" any favorite list of Altman for me starts with "3 Women" as well. I'm impressed that you saw it as a child! Makes me wonder what a young mind did with those images. <br />I wrote about "3 Women" way back when I started my blog, but it's one of the few films I want to revisit on this site. <br /><br />http://lecinemadreams.blogspot.com/2009/11/3-women-1977.html<br /><br />Back then I was more concerned with keeping a film diary...these days I like to go into what a film means to me and perhaps look at what a film like this expresses (5 years later) compared to what "3 Women" had to say in the 70s.<br />Thanks for asking about it and jogging my memory!<br />Ken Andersonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04940648971296673233noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2627032459273165000.post-79358406417935730142015-03-07T18:41:27.884-08:002015-03-07T18:41:27.884-08:00Another great one, thanks Ken. I am watching Xanad...Another great one, thanks Ken. I am watching Xanadu (yes, THAT Xanadu) now and thanking you for making me want to revisit it.<br /><br />Although I love this movie, and wow - that solo still of Cher above is just stunning - I long for you to give your treatment to Altman's "Three Women." A favorite of mine (is it wrong that I watched it as a child?), and one you use for a nice compare/contrast above.<br /><br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2627032459273165000.post-87348807885651970432015-03-06T15:18:55.918-08:002015-03-06T15:18:55.918-08:00Glad you checked it out!
Yes, it's too bad the...Glad you checked it out!<br />Yes, it's too bad there weren't more extras on the DVD. Especially too bad Altman wasn't around for the DVD commentary. His commentary tracks for his films are like taking a film course.<br />i agree with you that the interview with the playwright is like a controlled rant. One I think he has been resentfully holding onto in the shadow of all the attention accorded Altman, and all the brickbats hurled at his play.<br />I was amused by the "score to settle" tone of Graczyk's interview. I think I can understand his artistic frustration at having someone take over you work, but his ego seems to blind him to the failings of his play and how (whether he liked it or not) in many ways Altman was the best thing to happen to him.<br />Every artist fights for their vision, but I'm not too sure where Graczyks confidence in his vision comes from. Just as he did for the rather pulpish novel "That Cold Day in the Park", I think Altman found the art amidst Graczyk's artifice.<br />So appreciate your returning here with the update, Rick! Thanks!Ken Andersonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04940648971296673233noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2627032459273165000.post-69404091246005657642015-03-06T09:10:09.257-08:002015-03-06T09:10:09.257-08:00Just watched "Jimmy Dean" the other day....Just watched "Jimmy Dean" the other day...I was not disappointed.<br /><br />But what a drag that the only extra on the DVD was the interview with the playwright, Ed Graczyk. The history of his play is fascinating and Ed is certainly entitled to his take on Altman's take on his play. But it felt like a very controlled rant about his play being ruined. And at the very end, he comments that the play is done dozens of times a year and someday he will see the version that he sees in his mind...I doubt he ever will!<br /><br />If it wasn't for Altman and Cher going ahead with the film version of "Jimmy Dean," the play would probably be a dim memory...far less performed, and far less royalties for Graczyk. <br /><br />At least he had nice things to say about Sandy Dennis!http://ricksrealreel.blogspot.com/https://www.blogger.com/profile/14243899548141583461noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2627032459273165000.post-42318612925285139702015-03-05T07:11:01.579-08:002015-03-05T07:11:01.579-08:00"Funny to have first seen this when I was so ..."Funny to have first seen this when I was so young, and again now that I'm older than the characters."<br /><br />Oh, my yes. Seeing CABARET as an adolescent, I thought Liza Minnelli really was a glamorous adult leading a glamorous life. Revisiting it decades (upon decades!) later, I was stunned by how young she was, practically a baby, and playing with fire. It was at a BC/EFA fund raising screening a few years ago and Liza was there... on crutches. Yes, things change with time. Indeed, they do.George W. Tushhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13050905945846094987noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2627032459273165000.post-78924346824817243742015-03-04T13:23:46.340-08:002015-03-04T13:23:46.340-08:00Hi George
Oh, I did indeed read that NY Times revi...Hi George<br />Oh, I did indeed read that NY Times review (way back when the show opened, but more recently in researching this post) and it is pretty scathing. I'm not a theater person, but I think the kind of celebrity stunt-casting so common on Broadway now wasn't so prevalent then, and Cher hitting the boards was enough to make the show a nightly sell out. <br />Even the playwright says that the film is better than the stage production, but that neither one is really "his". I think he should be grateful for that.<br />I don't have the same problem with the play as you, but I agree that the film is salvaged and made watchable exclusively on the strength, charisma and skill of the cast. They spin straw into gold.<br />I'm glad it finally came out on DVD as well. <br />Funny to have first seen this when I was so young, and again now that I'm older than the characters. Memory plays like this seem to improve with age.<br />Glad to know you're a a fan of this film too! Ken Andersonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04940648971296673233noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2627032459273165000.post-6106650745375567842015-03-03T13:52:32.330-08:002015-03-03T13:52:32.330-08:00Love, love, love this movie. I saw it in an NYC c...Love, love, love this movie. I saw it in an NYC cinema when it was released and it didn't look good then. If you told me it was shot on Super 8 film, I could believe you. The short shooting schedule could only have exacerbated the limitations inherent in the 16mm format. That this quirky little film exists at all is a miracle and a testament to Cher. One must read Frank Rich's scathing NY Times review of the Broadway production to appreciate the miracle of Cher and her fund raising abilities. It's not just a bad review, it's a very bad bad review. Eek.<br /><br />The play is dreadful, but Altman is Altman and he conjures up things that only he can conjure. And here he gets to conjure with richly drawn characters and good actors portraying them. Sadly, the script makes about as much sense as The Sound of Music. But just as SOM is salvaged by the winning performance of Julie Andrews, the performances in Come Back to the Five and Dime are wonderful and save the day.<br /><br />That's the only reason to watch this lovely little weirdo of a movie. The performances. Sudie Bond is unforgettable. Everyone is. I am so happy that it has been preserved on Blu-ray.<br /><br /> George W. Tushhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13050905945846094987noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2627032459273165000.post-55508748133376562492015-03-02T15:05:07.747-08:002015-03-02T15:05:07.747-08:00Hey Chris
I'm not surprised that this is one o...Hey Chris<br />I'm not surprised that this is one of your favorites. It was released on Blu-Ray and DVD last November. The copy looks the best I've ever seen it (as good as a 16 mm blow up can, I guess).<br />i remember when it aired on cable tv, and I really think that is the last time I saw it. I never had it on VHS.<br /><br />And yes, it does have quite a remarkable cast! I forgot about Sudie Bond in "Silkwood", I can see her now getting scrubbed down like a dray horse.<br />And you mentioned about Graczyk never doing another show of note- I took a look at a couple of YouTube clips of semi-professional /amateur productions of "Jimmy Dean," and I really wonder if I would have liked the story at all except under Altman's care and with this cast. What I saw really make the this show look like an unseen "Eunice" episode.<br />Lastly, I had no idea I had a small hand in your owning "Night Watch" and "Dinah East"! Some of your friends might consider me and my blog a bad influence. :-)<br />Thanks Chris, for always being so encouraging to me, and I hope you get your hands on a copy of the "Jimmy Dean" DVD! Ken Andersonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04940648971296673233noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2627032459273165000.post-65931991104836673142015-03-02T10:15:31.863-08:002015-03-02T10:15:31.863-08:00Ken, thanks for highlighting one of my all-time-fa...Ken, thanks for highlighting one of my all-time-favorite "forgotten" films. I have always loved Robert Altman because he takes risks and chances, and this is just about his quirkiest movie. It's obviously quickie and low-budget, and I never saw it play any movie theater near me...I first saw it on HBO where it was scheduled at like 3 a.m. on a Tuesday. Thank God for Beta-Max! <br /><br />BUT we are lucky to have this filmed record of the play, which unfortunately flopped...poor Ed Graczyk never did anything else of note; his play was already a little old-fashioned for its time. (Although Steel Magnolias did indeed bring the genre back to life, as you note, a few years later.) <br /><br />All I can say is, what a cast! I am a huge fan of Karen Black and Sandy Dennis, and Cher is just marvelous. Also fun to see Kathy Bates pre-Misery...I would definitely put Jimmy Dean on each of these actors' "Best Films Of" list, despite its original failure. <br /><br />Cher's next film, Silkwood, also has Sudie Bond (Juanita) as a fellow nuclear plant worker who gets "fried" by radiation...I guess Mike Nichols remembered her from this film as well...<br /><br />Ken, I wonder what version of the DVD you have which has the Ed Graczyk interview? The DVD I have is a homemade VHS transfer I bought from a fellow film fanatic, but if there is a better print with that extra footage, I'd love to have it. Let me know. <br /><br />Again, thanks for covering this little-known GEM of a film!! Thanks to you, I now own Night Watch and Dinah East and count them among my all-time favorite films. This blog is so stimulating for all us movie freaks!! You are awesome!<br />-Chrisangelman66https://www.blogger.com/profile/16471674180789592940noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2627032459273165000.post-59083450664973703132015-03-02T09:46:30.943-08:002015-03-02T09:46:30.943-08:00Hi Joel
Before my partner gifted me with a DVD of ...Hi Joel<br />Before my partner gifted me with a DVD of this film for Christmas, more than 25 years had passed since I saw it.<br />I love seeing films I enjoyed in my youth and discovering to what extent my advanced age and maturity (or lack of it) changes how I perceive it.<br />It holds up remarkably well, and I think you'll enjoy Karen Black in subdued mode. Although I think Dennis is fantastic here, based on what you wrote, I sense she'll drive you up a wall! (Your appraisal of these actresses is hilarious...I adore Karen black, But who couldn't help but smile at a description of some of her performances as being "nerve wracking?"<br /><br />i really like seeing Cher's old face (I've always liked it more than the revamped version) and I think the plot feels less contrived to me now than it once did.<br />I think you're on the right track in noting that Altman was a a good choice for the material and the quirky cast is rather perfect for the quirky plot. With a more "normal" cast, I think it would come off like "Steel Magnolias,"<br />i still have yet to see "Women's World" but on your recommendation i caught "Where Love as Gone" as soon as I could. <br />I'm always flattered that you return to read these posts and always contribute to the always interesting dialog in the comments section.<br />Thanks so much, Joel! If you ever give this another look, let us know what you think.Ken Andersonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04940648971296673233noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2627032459273165000.post-19451955592072776692015-03-02T09:07:08.880-08:002015-03-02T09:07:08.880-08:00Hi Ken,
Wonderful as usual, like Rico I enjoyed y...Hi Ken,<br /><br />Wonderful as usual, like Rico I enjoyed your look at celebrity culture and its pervasiveness.<br /><br />It has been many,many years since I've watched this. I saw it upon initial release in theatres, a little arthouse theatre in the city with a friend and about 30 others in the place so my memory of it isn't terribly strong. I remember the three leads, the major inducement for my buddy and I to go-he being a big Karen Black fan and me because I had seen a shot of the three of them in a row publicizing the play and thought what a trippy line up. But I have no memory of Kathy Bates even being in it, it would be worth watching again just to see her then.<br /><br />We both liked it but I also recall telling various friends and family that I had seen it and getting a blank stare. Once I mentioned the cast there were flickers of recognition but it seemed very few even knew about the film. My recollection is hazy but I do recall thinking that the quirky cast fit the material and that Altman was the right director for the material. <br /><br />I thought Cher came across best but then my liking of both Sandy Dennis and Karen Black is on the cooler side. They can be fine if they keep their individual flutterings and stutterings in check, a little of that goes a long way. For instance Sandy won the Oscar for Virginia Woolf and I can't bear her in it, but in Up the Down Staircase where she's under control for me she's much better. Black at times was even more nerve wracking, she could bounce back and forth between restraint and excess in the same film but when she modulated her work she could be very good. <br /><br />You're really on a tear bringing us one fantastic piece after another lately and I thank you. Look forward to whatever you turn your eyes to next but I'm always hopeful that someday you'll get around to the train wreck that is Where Love Has Gone or one of my personal favorites the lush corporate soaper Woman's World with Betty Bacall, Arlene Dahl and June Allyson.joel65913https://www.blogger.com/profile/14526657073681774683noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2627032459273165000.post-26925143313340921922015-03-02T08:50:14.337-08:002015-03-02T08:50:14.337-08:00Hi Rick
Why thank you very much! I'm glad you ...Hi Rick<br />Why thank you very much! I'm glad you liked the post. My partner and I were talking at length about the many things "Jimmie Dean" is about, but what always resonated most strongly for me was what it had to say about the necessity of choosing real life over fantasy. <br /><br />I suppose it has a lot to do with my being gay and having been raised Catholic. I grew up around false idols!<br /><br />While researching this post I read that Cher had been read for the for the Joanne role (and I learned Sally Kellerman was an early Joanne choice, as well as Shelley Duvall for Edna Louise), but I had no idea of her reluctance to do the movie.<br />Athough I was a big fan of Cher too, I remember being rather astonished at how good she was. I liked her, but she was practically a Charo figure to me. she had been impersonated and parodied so long i was never sure I'd be able to take her seriously in a role. She knocked my socks off in this.<br />Around the time she made "Suspect" I felt the promise of her screen career was fading, but she was totally enchanting in "Moonstruck."<br /><br />And thanks for mentioning the Sandy Dennis impersonation scene! It got the biggest laugh when i saw it in the theater. I have to believe it was one of those improvisations that drove the playwright so crazy, but for anyone who thought Sandy Dennis had it coming, Cher totally nailed it. I can see it in my minds eye now. Such a hoot!<br />Congrats on re-upping with Netflix, and I'm pleased the films we've discussed here are also the ones you're most interested in revisiting!<br />Good to hear from you, Rico! Thanks for coming back for your "fix"!Ken Andersonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04940648971296673233noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2627032459273165000.post-86654223150149602015-03-02T08:05:40.200-08:002015-03-02T08:05:40.200-08:00Ken, What a great post, not just about "Jimmy...Ken, What a great post, not just about "Jimmy Dean," but the public and pop culture. <br /><br />I too, was a gay teen who discovered old movies on TV. During the '70s, I watched Cher every week on TV, and read about Liz Taylor's travails in the tabloids like a research scientist. But as I headed into my 20s, I realized that pop culture had its place, but I needed to live a real life. And that meant coming out. But obviously, I still love movies and movie stars, or I wouldn't be visiting here for my fix ; )<br /><br />Your post on "The Last of Sheila" inspired me to renew my Netflix account after 6 years and guess what's the next movie on my list: "Jimmy Dean"! Great minds think alike!<br /><br />Did you know Altman originally offered Cher the Karen Black role? But she asked to play Sissy? A smart move on Cher's part, because it is a more down-to-earth role, without the stunt-like surprise of Joanne's character.<br /><br />It took Cher nearly a decade to get into movies, because her image was so strong, and apparently negative to studios. I always thought that attitude was crazy, because her skills on TV went from a stone faced mannequin to an ingratiating, funny, glamorous but down-to-earth broad in the manner of old stars like Ann Sheridan, Linda Darnell or Carole Lombard. <br /><br />What's ironic is that after the play ended, Altman approached Cher about doing the film viersion of "Jimmy Dean." Cher didn't really want to as she was signed for "Silkwood" and on her way to a movie career. But when Altman told her he couldn't get the financing without her name, she immediately said yes. So celebrity has its uses and Cher finally was proved as a viable name in movies. I always wished she would have continued in this direction, but the lucrative business of being "Cher" trumped her movie career.<br /><br />I look forward to hearing the playwright's commentary, but he really should thank his lucky stars that Altman chose to bring his work to the stage and film.<br /><br />Oh, and don't you love the scene where Cher's Sissy mocks Sandy Dennis' facial tics? Dennis used to drive my Mom crazy with her mannerisms and she laughed out loud when she saw Cher skewer them!<br /><br />I look forward to seeing "Jimmy Dean," finally out on DVD...what took so long?http://ricksrealreel.blogspot.com/https://www.blogger.com/profile/14243899548141583461noreply@blogger.com